Cheese, Charcuterie and More: Exploring Aperitivo with Amy Ruis

It's really about the customers.

2

And when they give me kudos

for what I'm doing, I'm like.

3

All right, I can keep doing this because

you are coming back here saying Please

4

keep doing what you're doing for, food or

do what you're doing for Grand Rapids So I

5

think that that's the biggest thing for me

is like having people that are outside of

6

the organization say to me you can do it.

7

Cliff Duvernois: Hello everyone, and

welcome back to Total Michigan, where

8

we interview ordinary Michiganders

doing some pretty extraordinary things.

9

I'm your host, Cliff DuVernois.

10

So I'm still in Grand Rapids.

11

And there are so many great stories here.

12

And one of the things that I really wanted

to do in Grand Rapids while I was here

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was to check out the Downtown Market.

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If you haven't been here, you

really should come because

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this place is just full of all

really all kinds of cool shops.

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Anyways, I was able to connect

with today's guest because I've

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never had anybody on the show

before to talk about cheese.

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So that's what we're doing today.

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Today I have on the show, Amy Ruis, owner

of Aperitivo, as well as Art of the Table.

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Amy, how are you?

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I'm well, thank you.

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Excellent.

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So why don't you tell

us what is Aperitivo?

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Amy Ruis: We are a shop here in the

downtown market in downtown Grand Rapids.

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And we sell cheese, charcuterie,

wine, beer, and other gourmet foods.

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And we have a wine bar where

you can eat all of those things.

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Or you could take them home with you.

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Cliff Duvernois: So I guess my

next question is going to be is,

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is it okay if I just move in?

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Amy Ruis: Sure!

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Everyone should.

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I'll just bring rations of wine

to you at certain intervals.

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Cause that's like,

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Cliff Duvernois: that's like

four or five of my love languages

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that you just said there.

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So, okay.

37

Let's take it, let's take a

little bit of a step back.

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So why don't you tell us where

you're from and where you grew up.

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Amy Ruis: Oh, great question.

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Well, I'm kind of from Grand Rapids.

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I was born elsewhere, but, I

consider myself a Grand Rapidian.

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I grew up right, here with a great

family who was interested in food,

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but not in the industry at all.

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So this was just something

that I love to do.

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But I'm right from here and I

love staying in Grand Rapids, even

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though I was going to leave at one

point, drew me in, drew me back.

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Cliff Duvernois: So let's take,

let's unpack a couple of things.

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So first off, so you come

from a family of foodies.

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Amy Ruis: Yes, my

grandmother loved to cook.

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And you had to have different, colors of

things on your plate, not drab plates.

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That's where I learned good things from.

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And then also my family loved to set a

good table when they were, when we were

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sitting down to eat, it was always a fun

meal to experiment with different things.

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Artichokes, blue cheese,

anchovies, cheese.

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Cliff Duvernois: So what then brought

you to Grand Rapids in the first place?

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Amy Ruis: I think my family

just had a job change.

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That's what brought us to Grand Rapids.

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What kept me in Grand Rapids, I think,

is probably the real question of, I

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went to college and I was going to

get out of here and I never left.

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I Haymarket Square, which was,

like all the kitchen implements

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you'd ever want, every gadget,

all the dinnerware, cookware.

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And I started managing there,

not knowing much about it, and

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it flourished into that, being

a sales rep for those products.

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And then opening my own shop.

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which I still own called Art of the Table.

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And then aperitivo jumped out

of Art of the Table because

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we didn't have enough space.

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So we thought, why not do

what we know we like to do?

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One of them is we loved cheese.

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And I had a cheesemonger on

staff who said, let's do this.

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We need more space.

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So we started this together.

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And then secondly, we wanted a

place to do wine tastings and beer

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tastings and get people together in

a space to experience those things.

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And we don't have that

space at Art of the Table.

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So we were just like,

that's a retail shop.

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This is more of a place where you

can come to the market and experience

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it as well as take it home with you.

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Cliff Duvernois: So you decided

to open up Art of the Table.

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Why?

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I mean, there's easier things to do in

life, like take up golf or take up tennis

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or pickleball or something like that.

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But you decided to play entrepreneur.

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Amy Ruis: I like to say that I'm a

little crazy because I love retail.

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I love retail a lot, like to the

extent that like that is my life.

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I love to do retail.

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I love to have people come to me to find

good things that will trust me with that.

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I was saying that I was a sales

rep earlier in my career as well.

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I tried that out and it was.

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I won't call it a horrible experience,

but almost I just learned from it

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and I learned that what I should

not do is go drive my car to a store

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and ask them to buy things from me.

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It's just not me.

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And so I realized that early on when I was

doing that after I'd already done retail

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for a while that I really like retail.

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So I went back into the land of

retail and opened a shop on Wealthy

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Street, which at that time, we

were the second thing to open.

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And it was a bakery that opened before us.

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And then we did a year later,

and before that it was basically

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like, just a bad street.

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It had nothing, except for, bad juju.

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Yeah.

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So we opened and things

started happening 20 years ago.

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Cliff Duvernois: So that's really cool.

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Art of the Table.

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What is it that you sell there?

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Amy Ruis: We sell basically

the same things we sell here.

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But in a broader sense.

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So we have a lot of gourmet food.

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We have beer and wine and spirits there.

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We don't have spirits here, just there.

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Uh, And then also tabletop accessories,

serving pieces, tablecloths, glassware.

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Lots of cool foodie things.

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The reason I called it Art of the Table

was all these things go on your table.

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And I consider them art because

somebody is making them for you and

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somebody is making this look like art.

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Because you're making a good table set.

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Cliff Duvernois: When you

decided to do this, this is.

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This whole concept is more higher end.

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what made you think that you were

going to be successful doing it?

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Amy Ruis: Well, if we're talking

Art of the Table, I had no

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idea if I'd be successful.

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And I think that that was a very

interesting time in my life when, I was.

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My parents always said, you're young

and you can fail and start over again.

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And you believed it.

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And I believed it.

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So I just went for it.

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And I really have always just gone for it.

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And I don't know where I come up

with that sense of myself that I

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can just I'm going to try that.

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But I do, I try it and Art of the Table

could have been one or the other things.

132

Obviously, this could have been too, but

we rested on our laurels of people know

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us, people trust us, people love the

product we're bringing to them already.

134

Why would it not succeed

here in the downtown market?

135

We have been successful for 10

years over here and just bringing

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people the things they want.

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And they're so thankful to have that.

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It is a higher end concept.

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But not I feel like it's

not out of reach for people.

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most people I should say, I think that

we have ways that people can experience

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our space in small ways, small cut of

cheese, a little bit of charcuterie, a

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little jam to go with it or to take home.

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and do that on the budget and a

little bit more, or you can sit

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here and you can elaborately.

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Order all the food we have on the

menu and bottles of wine or glasses

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of wine and experience that too.

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Cliff Duvernois: So you opened up Art of

the Table and things started taking off.

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Were you surprised by that?

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Amy Ruis: Relatively, yeah.

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Yes, I was surprised at how well

they took off as quickly as they did.

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Sure.

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I think Grand Rapids was

hungry for that at that time.

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There are few places to shop

for those kinds of things.

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There are a couple of

those stores in town.

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There's a lot more of that,

of this kind of food out there

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now at the bigger box stores.

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Grocery stores have, fancy

food as well these days.

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But I think that the way that we have

always created it and attended to it and

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showed people that we care about it I

think is a really big change from a lot

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of the ways that people present, good food

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Cliff Duvernois: So Aperitivo was born

out of the fact that you were running

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out of space at Art of the Table, because

Art of the Table is primarily retail.

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Yep.

164

Were, did you, at that time, did

you have places set up where, where

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people could come and like have

a table, invite their friends?

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Amy Ruis: No, and that's

really why this was it.

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That we're, where we were

like, this is an opportunity.

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When the downtown market

opened, we were in here first.

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We're, we're originals.

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I guess I'd say.

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And so we didn't have a space to do that.

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So the opportunity was put this in

front of people in a different way.

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And let them experience a sit down.

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and we only, we've actually expanded

since we opened, during COVID.

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So we only had, about, uh, 22 seats,

early on until three years ago.

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And now we have 60 plus the outdoor.

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Cliff Duvernois: So when you were

thinking about opening up Aperitivo, why

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come to the Downtown Market to do it?

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Amy Ruis: I think that just knowing

what they were attempting to

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bring into the food world through

this one building was exciting.

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Because with a fishmonger with

a bread purveyor with coffee

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people, yeah, all these things.

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And you were like, okay, well,

if they're all going to be there,

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I should probably be there too.

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it would have been far easier for me to

set up one block away from my location

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where I could just walk back and forth.

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That would have been great, but we

wanted to give this A really good

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chance to show what it could do.

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And the opportunity for food

people coming here was good.

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Cliff Duvernois: Why the

focus on cheese and wine?

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Amy Ruis: I think we

love to educate people.

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And I think that we want to

expand people's horizons.

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And with doing run of the mill that

everyone else might do, or doing

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just a jam, doing some place, selling

widgets of some sort, that is easy to

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do, of course we choose cheese, where

it's, you know, A different hole.

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It's an in depth category.

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So is wine.

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So is beer.

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All these categories that we chose.

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I always choose the hard road,

not the easy one, of course.

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Right?

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Like why didn't I do that?

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So I feel like we, we chose a thing

that was interesting, that had

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growth that we could make here.

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and that we could just

keep showing people that.

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You don't need to just eat cheddar or

you don't need to just drink that wine

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that you find at the grocery store.

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Like we're going to take this

product and this product and

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we're going to mash them together.

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And if you, and you can have, six

different Rhone wines some night for a

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tasting and you can have six different

cheeses on that plate, all that create

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a different outcome of joy when you're

having them and you never know which one.

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But, yeah, it's just an opportunity

to let people try new things.

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And West Michigan's not always

ready to try new things.

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I feel like.

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There was, it was a little bit

of a learning curve there too,

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where you're like, well, how much

Alpine Swiss cheese can we sell?

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How many?

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Things, but we told them, this is good.

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Try this.

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And people believe us.

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Cliff Duvernois: And actually that

would be something worthwhile exploring

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is that educational component to it.

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Because it's not only educating

your customers to come up and, Hey,

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let's try some different cheeses.

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Talk to us a little bit

about that education process.

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How do you get, if somebody were to

walk up to the counter and be like, you

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know what, this is all foreign to me.

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Like, where do you go?

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Where do you even get started?

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Amy Ruis: Yeah.

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We try really hard to educate our

staff, like from the get go, like get

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them, a lot of people, some people

come to us knowing a lot about cheese.

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But most people don't.

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So we have to just You know,

that's our staff kind of stuff.

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We have to get them intrigued in it, too.

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They're intrigued enough to

come work here, which is great.

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And then after that, you have

to tell them all the stories.

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Because every cheese that

we carry has a story.

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Why is it made?

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Why is it here?

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and so there's a lot to learn.

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There's a lot.

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And it's just wine's the same.

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Or beer's the same.

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There's a reason.

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And again, that goes back to the

artistic part of this whole thing.

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Why is that here?

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Why did I choose that one versus

I could have chosen this one might

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be 10 cheaper or might be more

readily available, but I'd rather

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do the thing that is unique to it.

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So educating people, I guess at that point

is just, trying to bring it, make it fun.

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And I think that we do make it fun.

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We've got people who are just like, yeah.

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have the best time handing out a

sample and watching people's faces.

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Like wow, that's awesome or Oh

God, I will never eat that again.

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Get that out of here.

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There are both, you know.

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We have all those.

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We have kids who are five years old

who are some of our best customers who

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are like Give me more of this cheese.

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And really we have fancy, we have fancy

kids around here now because they're like,

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we have one kid who spends his birthday

here every year since he was five.

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And he's 12 now.

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He just spent his birthday

here last week and he will.

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That's where he asks

to go for his birthday.

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And he comes here with his

parents and buys crazy cheese.

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And it's, it's really fun

watching people grow up.

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You know, from little ones or just

adults who are like, I only like cheddar.

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And the next thing you do

is have well, just try this.

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And then they're like,

what does this taste like?

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Oh, it has notes of this or that.

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Oh yeah.

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I taste that.

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Now I want to try something different.

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Those kinds of, experiences, I

think, with our staff, is most fun.

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I always think that the busier

times are so much fun because you

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just can, like, one person after

another gets excited about things.

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Cliff Duvernois: For our audience,

we're going to take a quick

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break and thank our sponsors.

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When we come back, uh, Amy's

going to talk to us a lot more

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about cheese, wine, bubbly.

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We'll see you after the break.

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Hello everyone.

302

And welcome back to Total Michigan,

where we interview ordinary Michiganders

303

doing some pretty extraordinary things.

304

I'm your host, Cliff Duvernois.

305

And today I am hungry.

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So we're talking with Amy Ruis,

owner of Aperitivo, as well as Art

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of the Table, and we're actually

sitting right now in Aperitivo.

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Amy, before the break, we were

talking about the wonderful

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response of the customer base

coming in here and trying out your

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cheeses, everything else like that.

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Starting any kind of business

always has like it's challenges.

312

And there's always some point in time

where you just like you almost get

313

frustrated and I know you said that, you

know, you're pretty tenacious, you know,

314

when it comes to this, but why don't

you share with us maybe one or two of

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the challenges that you had to overcome

to make a Aperitivo what it is today?

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Amy Ruis: I think the hardest thing

in my whole career here at Aperitivo

317

was I started with a business partner.

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And I don't have a

business partner anymore.

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And so doing it on my own, I have had,

I had a fad, fantastic manager that was

320

here for a very long time and I've had

different people, you know, supporting

321

me and supporting roles, as we go.

322

But I think the hardest thing

is just doing a business.

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Being the manager of this business

and of my other business, I

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also have a manager there.

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But between that, there's a

lot to do as a business owner.

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And I love when, when I started,

people would say, Oh, your

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store's open only from 10 till 8.

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It must be nice sleeping in.

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And I'd say things like, Oh really?

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You clearly don't have a business.

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Yes, I, yes.

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I get up and get going most days

and I have some flexibility in

333

that, but also there's a lot to

do and I never quite get it done.

334

And especially during the holidays,

it's 24 seven that I take naps, I say

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like in the middle of the night during

the holidays, that's about it because

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that's all this time I have for sleep.

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But the, yeah, I would say that

there have been difficulties in that

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structure that I have of this business.

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I also think that the market

itself is it ebbs and flows.

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It's whether people come to see us.

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Is whether they're excited or not

about the market at that moment,

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if they think it's good or bad.

343

So I think Grand Rapids is a

little finicky in that and so

344

there's a little bit of oh the

market Is it really doing well?

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Are you doing okay?

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And I'm like, well come find out and

help us be okay, you know So that's what

347

my biggest message always is to people

is like don't assume it's good or bad.

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Get in here.

349

And experience what we've got going on.

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So I think that that would be

my Those would be my downfalls.

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Also, I can't do all the roles.

352

we have a kitchen.

353

We have server, servers.

354

We have experts in cheese and charcuterie.

355

And that's hard to be an expert of all.

356

especially when you're

trying to oversee it.

357

So, I would say that

that's my hardest stuff.

358

Cliff Duvernois: Has anybody ever

given you like a piece of advice when

359

you're doing this, that it's helped

you and sustained you as you go?

360

Amy Ruis: Well, I've got a couple.

361

But one is customers.

362

It's really about the customers.

363

And when they give me kudos

for what I'm doing, I'm like.

364

All right, I can keep doing this because

I'm doing it because you love it and you

365

are coming back here saying Please keep

doing what you're doing for, food or do

366

what you're doing for Grand Rapids or

do what you're doing for You know myself

367

too like because I love it So I think

that that's the biggest thing for me is

368

like having people that are outside of

the organization say to me you can do it.

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And then I have a really great support

Team, I guess I would say, which

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is my husband, my sister, my mom,

and then everyone who works for me

371

who's like rooting for us to be good.

372

So I have a good cheering

squad, which is good.

373

Cliff Duvernois: Let's pretend that

I've never been to a cheese shop before.

374

The only experience, exposure I've had to

cheese is like, you know, whatever I can

375

find on the shelf at the grocery store.

376

What should people be thinking about

when they come into a cheese shop?

377

Amy Ruis: I think that I always

tell people In cheese and also

378

it really works well with wine.

379

And everything like to really think

about what is you've liked in the

380

past and haven't liked in the past

and Go off of your comfort zone a

381

little bit in what you've liked.

382

So like hey i've loved Cheddar all

my life, or I've loved Gouda, but

383

I've only ever had smoked Gouda.

384

Well, try an aged Gouda.

385

so move that needle a little bit

and being willing to try something.

386

And then also, I think on the opposite

side, being willing to try something

387

that you've, not liked before, and

say, I'm going to try that again,

388

because it might be different.

389

For example, we probably have,

the thing we hear the most from

390

people is, I hate blue cheese.

391

that's the one people don't like, but we

have 14 blue cheeses over there right now.

392

And I think if people say, I

don't like blue cheese, that's

393

not fair to blue cheese.

394

Blue cheese needs, an audience

of this one's ultra creamy

395

and this one's ultra salty.

396

And this one is the, it's a compass of

blue cheese and there's no two are made

397

the same, which is why we have 14 and the

same with Gouda and the same with cheddar.

398

We sell.

399

We have our favorite cheddar

that we sell 10 to 50 pounds a

400

week, depending on the season.

401

And people love that cheddar

if you put it in their mouths.

402

But also, you know, don't feel

bad for that or feel bad for the

403

other cheddar that's sitting there.

404

We've got to try that one too.

405

So I think that having people

be willing to go off of there,

406

like I only eat cheddar helps.

407

When you walk into a shop like

this, just have an open mind.

408

Cliff Duvernois: It's

interesting you say that.

409

I was thinking back to, uh,

I'm a big Anthony Bourdain fan.

410

And in his book he talked about

cheese that smells like foot.

411

Yeah.

412

And I just remember like I wanted to

be totally adventurous and have that.

413

So I go into a cheese shop,

my only exposure at this

414

point is like cheddar cheese.

415

And I go in there and I find cheese

that smells like foot and I bite

416

into it and holy sweet Moses.

417

Yeah.

418

You know, I was like, I don't

think I'm quite ready for that.

419

Put it off to the side.

420

Amy Ruis: But sometimes I like to

say the bark is worse than its bite.

421

And so sometimes you might

find a cheese that smells like

422

feet or ammonia or whatever.

423

But if you just take a little

piece of that cheese and you're

424

like, all right, here we go.

425

And it tastes creamy

and salty and delicious.

426

And yet, but you have to

move the needle slowly.

427

I think again, going back to like, if

you're starting on cheese, we don't need

428

to give you the stinkiest blue cheese.

429

That smells like socks and

feet We don't want that.

430

We just want you to like it.

431

Cliff Duvernois: The wine.

432

The bubbly that you guys have.

433

I will say this right now for the record,

your collection here is impressive.

434

I mean, it's like you were talking

before about how you don't have cab on

435

the menu because so I guess my question

to you is a lot of the wines that you

436

have here are from outside of the U S.

437

Why?

438

Why go that route?

439

Amy Ruis: Several reasons.

440

I think that, while I really do like

some certain wines that are made in the

441

US, I think that European and beyond

wines are tend to be more interesting.

442

they are usually more small batch.

443

They're usually at least the ones we pick.

444

We try to do small batch things,

things that are made by people.

445

I've met a lot of people who

make the wines that we sell.

446

Um, that's important to me that they

are made well and made by a person.

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We can't only have wines that are,

maybe tiny batch because that just

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leaves you in a place where you

can't have variety of price often.

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but even in our variety of price,

we try to have even our lowest.

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lower end stuff, be things that we can

be proud of, like great examples of a cab

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or great examples of a sauvignon blanc.

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We have those here.

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but we also have some things

that are more esoteric.

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And there are different,

uh, grape varieties.

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So, yeah, I just tend to try to

find things that Impress me and

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are unique to me that come my way.

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Cliff Duvernois: The next question

I have, if somebody is coming here,

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what would be like some cheeses you

would recommend that they would try?

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Amy Ruis: I would recommend

everyone to try, something that

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again, pushes their comfort zone

to something that's either stinky

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blue, either blue or alpine cheeses,

German cheeses, that kind of thing.

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There are a lot that are just like,

a little bit more in that, feet zone.

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But, but I would also say to try

something just fresh and like

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a brie or like a goat cheese.

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Something that is just

independently made, small.

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we, like I have certain

ones that are my go tos.

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I also think that people should

try sheeps milk cheese more.

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Sheeps milk cheese is delicious and soft

and elegant and a lot of people might

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say, what does that really taste like?

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Like sheep's milk just

isn't what people go for.

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Um, But try them.

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They're delicious.

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And they're rewarding.

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So I think, St.

475

St.

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Rocco Brie is a brie that's made

here in Benton Harbor in Michigan.

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Oh, nice.

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Proud of that.

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Proud of Trillium, which is Tulip Tree

Trillium, which is down in Indianapolis.

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we have two of the best U.

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S.

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bries right here, within

hours of us being made.

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And so we can get them here quickly.

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And they are delightful.

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and we have things from Spain that

I would love to go, visit these

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creameries and like all this great

stuff comes back, to us that is just

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so perfectly textured and lovely.

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I could go into more detail.

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But I really think that people should

try things that they haven't seen before.

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Cliff Duvernois: And Amy, if somebody

is listening to this interview

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and they want to come check you

out, sample some cheeses, find you

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online, where can they do that?

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Amy Ruis: They can do that here at the

downtown market, uh, in Grand Rapids.

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435 Ionia is our address.

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We're in this big, lovely building.

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it's a LEED certified

building, which is really cool.

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It's really pretty here.

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And we're here 11 to 7 weekdays

and then 11 to 8 on Friday.

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Saturdays, 10 to 8, and then

Sundays, 10 to 7 as well.

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So we're here 7 days a week.

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You can easily find us.

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Our website is aperitivogr.

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com, and there are lots

of things on there.

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You can see our menu, you can see

our, some of our selections that

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we carry here, and wine and food.

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Cliff Duvernois: And classes.

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And classes.

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Which we didn't even have time to cover.

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Amy Ruis: Yes, yes.

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We have really fun things happening.

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We try to keep that going.

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on a, at least one a month of those

and, yeah, we really like to educate

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whether it's one or two people at a time

or, a lovely group setting at a table.

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Cliff Duvernois: Amy, thank you so much

for taking time to chat with us today.

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I really appreciate it.

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Thank you.

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And you're welcome.

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And for our audience, you can always

roll on over to TotalMichigan.

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com, click on Amy's interview and, uh,

get the links that she mentioned above.

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We'll see you next time when we

talk to another Michigander doing

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some pretty extraordinary things.

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We'll see you then.