Carol Brooks is the innovative owner of Foundry and the Hallway Entertainment in Port Huron, Michigan. Carol shares her inspiring journey from a photography and history graduate to becoming an entrepreneur who transformed a struggling art gallery into a vibrant hub for art and entertainment.
With a background deeply rooted in her love for photography and history, and a passion to enliven the Port Huron community, Carol ventured into creating the Hallway Entertainment, featuring escape rooms and game shows. She then took over a former nonprofit art gallery, morphing it into Foundry, a dynamic space offering a wide array of art-based activities like pottery classes, cosmic pottery, painting, splat rooms, and more.
Beyond providing entertainment, Foundry also offers immersive experiences with music, dancing, comedy, and various classes, affirming Carol’s commitment to making Port Huron a lively place for residents and visitors alike. Carol’s story is a testament to the power of creativity, community, and entrepreneurship in reviving and reimagining communal spaces for the betterment of society.
Links:
Foundry Website: (Click here)
Escape Rooms at The Hallway Entertainment (Click here)
Show Notes:
00:00 Introduction and Background
00:55 The Birth of Foundry: A Home for Art and Entertainment
01:50 Carol’s Journey: From Photography to Entrepreneurship
05:46 The Evolution of Escape Rooms
05:55 The Power of Entrepreneurship and Community Engagement
08:15 The Expansion of Foundry: From Pottery to Splat Room
14:16 The Listening Room: A New Dimension of Art
14:29 The Growth and Challenges of Foundry
23:10 The Future of Foundry: Iris Photography and More
24:46 How to Connect with Foundry
Transcript
Because the feeling of somebody buying a thing that you
2
:created from nothing is incredible.
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:And then take it a step further, not only
did they buy it, but then they loved it.
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:It's the best feeling.
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:Cliff Duvernois: Hello everyone and
welcome back to Total Michigan, where
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:we interview ordinary Michiganders
doing some pretty extraordinary things.
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:I'm your host, Cliff DuVernois.
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:I've done a couple of interviews
in the Port Huron area.
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:And I was actually very happy
to get this place on my list.
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:Because of one thing that came to
mind was like this could almost pass
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:as the unofficial center of Port
Huron Because there's just so many
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:great things to do here, including
art and getting people to create art.
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:And that is just something
that really appeals to me.
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:So today we are sitting with the
owner Carol Brooks of Foundry and the
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:Hallway Entertainment in Port Huron.
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:Carol, how are you?
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:Carol Brooks: I am great.
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:Thank you for having me.
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:Cliff Duvernois: So why don't you
just take a couple minutes and
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:just share with us what is Foundry.
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:Carol Brooks: Foundry is the home for
art and entertainment here in Port Huron.
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:It used to be, it, as in the
building, used to be a non profit
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:art gallery, And that, went really
well for a few years, and then
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:during COVID, things kind of slid.
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:And my original business was the Hallway
Entertainment, which is escape rooms and
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:game shows and interactive entertainment.
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:And I heard about, the studio
kind of having troubles.
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:And I decided I wanted to come on in
and add my own twist and spin on it.
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:So instead of keeping it just an art
gallery where people come to shop or
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:observe art, I twisted it, as I do, and
made it more of an art and entertainment
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:center where people are coming to
do and immerse themselves in art.
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:Cliff Duvernois: And that definitely
going to explore that a lot more.
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:Before we jump into that, why don't
you share with us where are you from?
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:Where did you grow up?
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:Carol Brooks: I grew up
right here in Port Huron.
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:Cliff Duvernois: now did you
go to, did you go to college?
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:Carol Brooks: Yeah, yeah, Yeah.
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:So, I went to Grand Valley State.
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:Okay.
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:And, I have a degree in
photography and in history.
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:I thought I wanted to be a high
school world history teacher.
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:I did that for a couple years, and
decided that wasn't really my cup of tea.
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:And my big plan was, you know, in
the summertime to shoot weddings.
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:Which I did do for a while.
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:And then, too many
bridezillas came my way.
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:And I decided that I lost interest.
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:So I lost my love for that
passion and, uh, I had to pivot
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:and go in a different direction.
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:Cliff Duvernois: so a
couple questions here.
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:First off why go to Grand Valley?
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:Carol Brooks: They have a really, they
have a really good photography program.
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:And that's what I wanted to do.
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:As a high schooler, I started
babysitting for a woman.
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:And she owned a photography studio.
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:And so orders were always coming
in while I'm watching her kids.
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:So I would start checking in orders.
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:And then one day, her second
photographer for a wedding was sick.
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:And so she called me.
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:And she's like, Any chance you can
just take this camera, I'll set
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:it on auto, and you just, you just
need to shoot some, some pictures.
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:And we'll, we'll see what we can do.
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:And, uh, I said yes.
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:And it turns out I had a little bit
of a, a natural eye for composition.
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:So I ended up, taking that
on as my job in high school.
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:And I fell in love with
photography from there.
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:Cliff Duvernois: And what
was it about history?
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:Carol Brooks: So my mother is British.
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:She moved here from Wales when she was 25.
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:And she never went back except
for to visit our family.
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:And I was, you know, drug over with her.
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:And castles were my
favorite thing to explore.
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:They still are.
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:And so I think that's where it started.
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:Going over there and seeing Stonehenge
and seeing castles and, I mean, the
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:ruins and the ones that are turned into
museums, it's just, it really piqued
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:my interest in art and in history.
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:So if I had to pinpoint where it
came from, I would guess it's that.
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:Cliff Duvernois: Now when you
talked before about going out and
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:teaching history, was that where
you, did you move back to the Port
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:Huron area and start doing it there?
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:Did you go to, did you teach someplace
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:Carol Brooks: So, um, at the time
when I graduated college, which
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:was in:in Michigan was pretty difficult.
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:They were really highly sought after.
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:Michigan was the highest paid
teachers, at that time, or close to
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:some of the highest paid teachers.
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:So I ended up in Lakeland,
Florida, where, yep, where the
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:Tigers have their spring training.
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:And I taught at a high school
down there for a couple years,
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:before I really missed Michigan.
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:And, um, I had to come back.
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:And so, I moved to Royal Oak.
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:And I lived there for a couple years.
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:And I found a job at a
company called CrowdRise.
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:Which was, an online fundraising
platform for charity.
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:And I used to tell people, that
we were like GoFundMe, but better.
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:Because instead of helping, Joe down
the street a fundraise for bagpipe
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:lessons, which was a real thing.
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:Um, uh, we were actually
helping non profits.
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:lots of really cool, great
causes and I loved that job.
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:But the joke ended up being on me.
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:Because we became a competitor
of GoFundMe, and seven
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:years ago, GoFundMe came in.
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:And they bought CrowdRise out.
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:And a bunch of us, were laid off.
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:And I loved that job.
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:And I'd been there from some
of the beginning stages of it.
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:And I felt a little salty.
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:So I thought to myself,
well, you know what?
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:I'm gonna go start my own business.
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:Because then I won't fire myself.
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:I just looked around Port Huron
and, thought, what do we need?
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:What's missing?
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:And as a person that grew up here,
I always heard, and I still do to
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:this day, which kind of breaks my
heart, but I always heard people say,
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:there's nothing to do in this town.
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:And I wanted to change that.
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:the first thing I started
with were the escape rooms.
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:Cliff Duvernois: All right,
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:Carol Brooks: So let's go
back I know there's a lot of
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:information in that little story.
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:Cliff Duvernois: I know.
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:I know.
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:So now let me ask you this because you're
like, well, you know, I'm just trying to
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:entrepreneur and just go out and do this.
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:did you have like, is there anything
in your background that pointed
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:it just said, you know, one day.
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:Carol Brooks: No, I mean the photography.
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:So I started working for that photography
company when I was in high school.
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:when I went away to college,
I did photography to help
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:put myself through college.
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:my mom helped too, but that was one
of my contributions to it, right?
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:And so I would shoot weddings
and senior portraits and babies.
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:And all of that stuff.
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:yeah, I, I, I guess I had
that as my first business
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:Cliff Duvernois: So now you've come
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:Carol Brooks: back to Port Huron, people
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:Cliff Duvernois: are telling you there'
nothing to do here like, you know what?
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:I'm gonna change that.
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:So you got into escape rooms.
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:Carol Brooks: Yeah.
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:Where did that come from?
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:I, um, well, so I had just, at
that time I had just been to an
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:escape room in Royal Oak, one of
the first ones that had opened.
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:And I loved it.
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:And I just thought that was a
cool idea that the Thumb needed.
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:A lot of Port Huron people will
drive down to Royal Oak or Detroit
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:to go find unique things to do.
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:And I've always wondered, well,
what about the people past Port
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:Huron in Lexington and Port Sanilac?
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:Well, are you going to drive all the
way to Detroit for an evening of fun?
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:Probably not that often.
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:But you might make it to Port Huron.
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:So, I decided to, to give it a try.
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:And it worked.
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:And, I literally, the first
escape room that I built, I
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:set it up in my dining room.
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:room that I invited my friends over.
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:Different groups of them.
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:Different nights.
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:And had them test out the puzzles.
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:And it turns out I had a bit of a
knack for coming up with these things.
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:And then I ran with it.
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:So escape rooms have evolved.
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:They literally at first were a
room where you were trying to
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:escape it by solving puzzles.
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:But, that storyline got played out
over the last ten years or so of
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:escape rooms being in existence.
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:And now they are more Interactive stories.
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:So imagine you and your group of friends
are stepping into a room that has a story.
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:And you get to play and interact with the
things in that room to complete the story.
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:So for example, one of our rooms is, is
an airplane You sit down in these airplane
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:seats and you see the screen and a flight
attendant comes on the screen and she
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:tells you, Oh no, we've passed through
some sort of time warp And, everybody on
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:the plane except for you have disappeared.
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:You have, one hour to break into
the cockpit and initiate the
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:landing sequence to save the plane.
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:Good luck.
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:And then the screen goes blank.
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:And you and your friends are in this room
that feels like you're in an airplane.
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:And you get to pick things up and
touch and, play and interact with
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:the things in the room, while
using your brain a little bit.
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:kind of complete the story.
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:Some people will, complete
the tasks within the hour.
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:Some people won't.
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:And, um, it's just a good,
fun, wholesome experience.
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:Cliff Duvernois: And because of the
fact that you're solving puzzles, so for
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:instance, one of the things is that there
could be a lock on a door, so you have
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:to put these puzzles together and arrange
and work together as a team to figure out,
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:what's the combination to work this lock.
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:Carol Brooks: And it's not just
um, puzzles that you think of in
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:terms of, like crosswords in Sudoku
or like physical jigsaw puzzles.
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:I'll give you an example
from one of my past rooms.
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:So it won't give anything away
on one of the current rooms.
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:We had a sunken freighter
room a couple years ago.
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:I like to have local history based rooms.
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:That's how I got my start was
with a Thomas Edison themed room.
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:But in the sunken freighter
room we had this, giant growler.
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:And it was glued down to a table.
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:And in the growler, if you looked
closely, there was a small key
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:on a cork, attached to a cork.
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:There's nothing that you can stick
into the growler to get that key out.
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:You can't lift the table or
lift the growler to shake it
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:upside down to get the key out.
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:There was a magnet in the room, so some
people would try to take the magnet and
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:magnet the key up the growler and out.
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:But if they paid enough attention,
they would see that there were jugs
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:of water and a funnel in the room.
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:Just enough that if they were to pour
all of the water into that growler, the
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:key and the cork would float up to the
top and they could just pick it out.
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:Cliff Duvernois: That is so cool.
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:Carol Brooks: So it’s not just puzzles
in the way that you think of it.
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:Yeah, and I try to make it so that
there's something for everybody.
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:There's the person that's logical and
they, they think in a linear fashion.
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:There's the person that
thinks outside the box.
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:And they need the water, puzzle, right?
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:So try to have something for
each type of brain in each room.
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:Cliff Duvernois: You decided you're
going to go into escape rooms.
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:How did you get started?
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:Carol Brooks: Oh, wow.
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:Well, like, like I said,
the dining room example.
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:I set up puzzles in, in my room,
in my dining room and had my
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:friends come over and play it and
realized that I could do this.
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:and then I went to some
local entrepreneur meetings.
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:And I found a property that was available
and I negotiated a step up rent.
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:So I started paying a little.
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:And then, after I got a little
momentum going, I then paid more.
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:And then a little bit longer, And, I paid
more until eventually, um, I, yeah, yeah.
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:And, that, That is a good
lesson for people that are
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:trying to start a business.
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:Don't be afraid to ask.
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:I mean, the worst thing
people can say is No.
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:And they might say yes.
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:That's how it started for me.
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:And then, after not even a full year,
in that first location, Um, we outgrew
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:that space and I just, yeah, it was nuts.
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:And, um, Yeah, so then I bought
a building just around the
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:corner from here and expanded.
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:And then a few years later bought
this one and expanded again.
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:Cliff Duvernois: So what was
your very first escape room?
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:Carol Brooks: Very first escape
room was Thomas Edison themed.
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:Because Port Huron is the
boyhood home of Thomas Edison.
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:And the story goes that he worked
on the Grand Trunk Railroad, which
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:ran from Port Huron down to Detroit.
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:And he sold newspapers and candy and stuff
like that to the passengers on the train.
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:The story also goes that he got
in trouble for having experiments
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:in one of the cars on the train.
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:And that's where he got thrown off
of the train by his ear and he lost,
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:he went deaf in one of his ears.
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:So I took all of that real
history and rolled it into
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:a fake story of time travel.
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:You, for example, time travel back to
this train car and you need to stop
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:Thomas Edison's experiment from blowing
up before you get back to the future.
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:Cliff Duvernois: What did it feel like
when the first people went into your,
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:I mean, they bought your tickets.
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:They're like, Hey, we're
looking forward to this.
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:We love to do escape rooms.
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:they bought it and there they go.
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:And you're standing there going, Holy cow.
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:Carol Brooks: I can't tell
you how good that feels.
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:And that's why I'm still doing this today.
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:Because the feeling of somebody
buying a thing that you created
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:from nothing is incredible.
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:And then take it a step further, not only
did they buy it, but then they loved it.
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:It's the best feeling.
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:it's really, really the best
feeling that I feel very lucky
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:that that's, um, what I get to do.
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:Cliff Duvernois: For our audience
we're going to take a quick
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:break and thank our sponsors.
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:When we come back, we're going to
continue to talk to Carol about
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:the Foundry and everything you
can experience when you come here.
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:We'll see you after the break.
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:Are you enjoying these amazing stories?
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join our community today.
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:Hello everyone, and welcome back to
Total Michigan where we interview
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:ordinary Michiganders doing some
pretty extraordinary things.
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:I'm your host, Cliff Duvernois.
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:Today, we're sitting with Carol Brooks
of Foundry located in Port Huron as
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:well as the Hallway Entertainment.
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:And Carol, before the break, you
were sharing with us a story about
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:how you had, you had rented a spot.
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:Your escape room was
starting to really take off.
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:You were outgrowing the space quickly.
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:There was a non profit that had this
building here that we're currently
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:in now that you currently own.
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:How did you go from that one space
that you had to being in this building?
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:Carol Brooks: So, after I outgrew the
rented space, I bought a building,
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:that if you could see through this
wall behind me, it's right back there.
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:And the Hallway Entertainment, the
escape rooms and game shows ran out of
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:that building for three or four years.
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:And I heard that this building that
we're in right now was going for sale.
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:So I put in an offer to, to buy it,
and I had looked at what had worked
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:really well for them, and what had
not they struggled with and formulated
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:my business plan around that.
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:And what would mesh well with my already
existing business of the escape rooms.
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:the interactive entertainment.
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:And so the first thing that we
started with was pottery classes.
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:Because that's something that
they had done really well.
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:And
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:Cliff Duvernois: So did your
offer include, leave the
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:Carol Brooks: All the kilns were
left behind with the building.
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:Yes.
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:Yeah.
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:Mm hmm.
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:So I just, uh, I reached out and
found some, some pottery instructors.
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:And now, we started with, just
like one time classes where
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:you'd come in for a couple hours
with your friends and have fun.
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:And then, from there people enjoyed it.
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:And we extended it to three
week and five week classes.
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:So now we have a mixture of, one
time classes, five week classes,
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:beginner level, intermediate
level, seasonal things.
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:In front of us right here I've got,
uh, ceramic pumpkins where, our
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:instructors threw the pumpkins and then
we branched out to have classes where
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:people just come in and paint them.
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:So we have like the whole spectrum of
pottery classes, painting, throwing,
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:hand building, one time, five
week, and it's been a pretty cool.
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:uh, journey.
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:Cliff Duvernois: The one thing that really
caught my eye especially going over your
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:website for this is the cosmic pottery
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:Carol Brooks: Okay, so we just launched
that and I'm really excited about it.
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:Our first, our first one
hasn't even happened yet.
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:It happens on Friday.
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:We're sold out.
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:Sold out to the point where we added, I
think, two more classes the following day.
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:Sold those out.
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:And added five more for March 16th.
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:So there's still a few spots there.
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:But think of cosmic bowling.
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:But with pottery.
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:So we've got black lights and neon
paint and you're in the dark with
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:some fun music and you're having
a full experience that's totally
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:different from anything else you're
going to find while making something
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:that you'll be able to take home.
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:Cliff Duvernois: Now the one
thing I do want to get to is the
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:painting aspect because you've got
different painting things going on.
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:We're in the splat room
room that you call it
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:Carol Brooks: Yep.
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:Cliff Duvernois: So where
did this idea come from?
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:Carol Brooks: So this one's goes
back to, people always ask me, how
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:do the escape rooms and foundry with
the art experiences intermingle?
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:And I've always had a hard time
explaining that except for the fact that
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:they're both interactive entertainment.
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:You know, you're, you're immersed in it.
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:But a couple years ago, my cousins
in Scotland, they said, Carol,
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:it looks like you're doing so
great with your escape rooms.
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:We want to do that.
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:Will you help us?
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:So I went over to Scotland,
helped my cousins open their
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:first escape room over there.
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:and so, yeah, so my games that
were designed here that Thomas
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:Edison, one I was telling you about.
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:They tweaked it.
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:And tweaked the characters and whatever,
and made it a Mary Queen of Scots game.
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:Because, that's right
about where they live.
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:And, anyway, they're doing so great.
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:Last year, they opened a splatter studio.
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:And I said, okay guys,
you took an idea from me.
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:I'm gonna take an idea from you now.
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:And so I, started doing the splat
stuff just like they had done.
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:And, we started with a space
that could only fit two people
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:to see if it would catch on.
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:People loved it.
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:And so we expanded into this whole room,
and now we can fit 10 people at a time.
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:So a birthday party.
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:and then, yeah, people come in and they,
they splat paint with a paintbrush.
377
:We have guns that they kind of
like squirt the, the canvases.
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:they can pour paint there's one over
here beside you where they get to like
379
:squeeze the bottle and, and drip it.
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:And it's just, I like to explain
it as a less angry rage room.
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:Cliff Duvernois: drip it.
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:And it's well so I can just see
that you have people come in here.
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:It's like cool I get to throw paint.
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:But do you give them any kind of
like instruction or anything else?
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:Because you know the thing is if
everybody threw every color of
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:paint at a canvas it would be like
387
:Carol Brooks: Brown Play Doh.
388
:Yeah, you know the kids that
just mix all the Play Doh
389
:together and it becomes brown?
390
:Yeah
391
:Yeah, so we try to give them a little
bit of explanation at the beginning.
392
:Maybe only use, three or four
colors at a time so that you
393
:don't end up with too much.
394
:Maybe paint your canvas background
So that instead of just having
395
:colorful paint on a white background.
396
:You've got something else.
397
:think about if you want to
add words afterwards, like
398
:the one behind you says lucky.
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:And it's all green and black and gold.
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:So to think about some of those things.
401
:And then, we give you a practice canvas
before you get your big one so you
402
:can try out the different techniques.
403
:Cliff Duvernois: So I guess the bigger
question is why is the Immersive
404
:experience into art so important to you?
405
:Carol Brooks: Ooh, that's a tough one.
406
:I, I mentioned earlier that I, I don't
like the fact that everyone always said
407
:there, there's nothing to do in this town.
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:I love Port Huron.
409
:It's my home.
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:I think we're very lucky to live right
here on this beautiful blue water.
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:And I want more people to
want to stay here and not
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:transplant themselves elsewhere.
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:And one thing that I can do
to help that is by providing a
414
:place for people to have fun.
415
:And, I'm not a big screen and
technology video game person.
416
:I don't watch TV.
417
:I want people to play and interact
with things in the real world.
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:And remember what it is to
just have, have fun again like
419
:you did when you were a kid.
420
:Yeah.
421
:Yeah.
422
:I don't know.
423
:It just, it's always just
kind of spoken to me.
424
:Cliff Duvernois: Now we talked
about the paint room, we talked
425
:about the different techniques here.
426
:But that's not all.
427
:That's not!
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:It's because when you were taking
me on the tour of this place, I was
429
:like, man, what doesn't she have here.
430
:That's why I kind of was like
thinking this is like the
431
:unofficial center of Port Huron.
432
:Carol Brooks: Can we get, can
we get that written somewhere?
433
:Yes, you can.
434
:Yes, you can.
435
:Yes, you
436
:it!
437
:Ah, okay!
438
:Cliff Duvernois: So, you
also have the Listening Room
439
:Carol Brooks: Yes, yep.
440
:Cliff Duvernois: Talk to us about that.
441
:Carol Brooks: again, my idea is immersive
entertainment and an art, right?
442
:And art is not just.
443
:Art is not just photography,
and painting, and pottery.
444
:Art is music, and dancing.
445
:the rooms upstairs, we have musicians come
in for songwriters rounds, where we'll
446
:have three or four musicians on the stage.
447
:And they talk about a
song that they've written.
448
:And then they play it.
449
:And then the next musician goes.
450
:And then the next musician goes.
451
:And then they start back over.
452
:It's an idea that they have in Nashville.
453
:And so we're doing that here.
454
:And then we have ballroom dancing and line
dancing, comedy, and drag queen bingo.
455
:All of these just different forms of art
in a way that maybe most people don't
456
:think of as art, if that makes any sense.
457
:Cliff Duvernois: Right.
458
:Now, to do all of these things, obviously
you can't do everything yourself.
459
:So, are there artists in the community
that are helping you out, whether
460
:that's like musicians that come or
sound engineers, or in this case, like
461
:we're in the, we're in the splat room.
462
:Carol Brooks: Yeah, we have
about 10 employees here.
463
:And so, yeah.
464
:So we've got one manager for Pottery
and he that's his baby back there.
465
:He gets to decide how to run that ship.
466
:We have another, another
manager for Foundry.
467
:And so she handles, like the splat
and upstairs, the, the dancing
468
:and, and, Listening Room classes.
469
:And then, we have another one
for mosaic and stained glass.
470
:I maybe create and initiate these things.
471
:But then I hand them to somebody to run
with so that they're getting the love
472
:and attention that they need because
if it was all in my hands, um, that
473
:would be too much for one person to do.
474
:Cliff Duvernois: because
photography is your background
475
:Carol Brooks: Yes.
476
:Cliff Duvernois: Do teach any
photography classes classes here?
477
:Carol Brooks: No, but, and I didn't even
tell you this in the walkthrough because
478
:I'm not, fully out there doing it yet.
479
:But, I just went to Italy,
for like a pre honeymoon.
480
:Right.
481
:And as I was wandering around, I
saw this gallery where they were
482
:taking pictures of people's irises.
483
:And so of course I went in and did it.
484
:And it was so, cool.
485
:And now I have this piece of artwork with
my and my new husband's irises together.
486
:And it's, it's, it's breathtaking.
487
:It's really cool.
488
:So I whipped out my camera and I'm going
to start doing that as my own thing here.
489
:People will be able to book and get
their or their kids or whoever's iris,
490
:a picture taken and then blown up into
their own unique piece of artwork.
491
:Cliff Duvernois: Yeah cause when we’re
talking about likee groups coming in
492
:and everything else so one of the things
that really struck me is the fact that
493
:you actually serve beverages here.
494
:Carol Brooks: Yeah, So,
it's like sip and splat.
495
:Yes, yes.
496
:Cliff Duvernois: Talk to us about that.
497
:us about that.
498
:Carol Brooks: it took 18
months to get a tavern license.
499
:I could have had two babies in
that amount of time, you know?
500
:oh, man Goodness gracious.
501
:That was a long process and
I almost gave up and I don't
502
:give up on things very often.
503
:But yeah, I thought it
would be a good compliment.
504
:I don't want to own a bar or a
restaurant because I don't want the
505
:focus to be on eating and drinking.
506
:I want the focus to be on the activities.
507
:But wouldn't it be great if you could
come in here and throw paint and
508
:have a White Claw or a Glass of Wine?
509
:And so now you can.
510
:And same thing with pottery classes.
511
:You can gather a group of friends.
512
:So we have scheduled classes.
513
:But if you have four or more people,
you can book a private party.
514
:Cliff Duvernois: Carol if somebody is
listening to this and they do want to you
515
:know maybe book out a room or check out,
you know, what it is that you're doing.
516
:Whatever.
517
:What's the best way for them to do that?
518
:Carol Brooks: So if you, want to
book one of our existing experiences,
519
:so something that's on the calendar
already, um, like we host, two
520
:stained glass classes a month.
521
:And those are just pre booked out,
you would go to foundryporthuron.
522
:com and then there's a book
here or a booking site button.
523
:You click on that and you'll be able to
see everything that's already available.
524
:Now, if you want to schedule a
private party, and you have four
525
:more people for any of our events
and things that we do you would email
526
:us at hello at FoundryPortHuron.
527
:com.
528
:And then if you're looking to do an escape
room or the game shows or any of that,
529
:murder mystery parties, any of that, you
would go to TheHallwayEntertainment.com
530
:Cliff Duvernois: Carol, it's been
awesome having you on the show today,
531
:and we're going to have to have you
back again, and congratulations.
532
:And
533
:Carol Brooks: you.
534
:Thank you.
535
:And we're always changing things, too.
536
:So, if we do this again in a year, I'm
sure I'll have four more things to talk
537
:Cliff Duvernois: See?
538
:There we go.
539
:That's another reason
540
:Carol Brooks: live.
541
:Yeah.
542
:Uh, For audience, uh, you always
roll on over to TotalMichigan.
543
:com and click on Carol's interview and get
all the links that she mentioned above.
544
:We'll see you next time when we talk
to another ordinary Michigander doing
545
:some pretty extraordinary things.
546
:We'll see you then.